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PostSubject: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Thu Nov 03, 2011 6:09 am

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/article/indycar-new-team-for-carpenter-two-cars-for-rahal-in-2012

3 new cars for next year. 2 for bobby rahal & RLL plus ed carpenter running his own team
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Thu Nov 03, 2011 9:52 am

Good news about Bobby Rahal fielding at least two cars on a full time basis. I wouldn't be surprised if Ed Carpenter drives his own car on ovals, and get another driver to race on road/street course races. Ed isn't exactly great on road courses.

Briscoe got confirmed at Penske for another season.

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:03 pm

I am surprised Briscoe got another go with penske consider how relatively poor he was last year.
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sat Nov 05, 2011 6:18 am

Will Power has made Team Penske look better than they are for the past two seasons. Penske only has one win in the past two seasons from its other drivers, and that was Castroneves with a late race caution deal at Barber MP last year.

Ganassi has been whipping Penske's butt for a while.

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PostSubject: is it april fools already?   Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:59 am

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/article/indycar-series-confirms-china-race

this has been announced before and never happened, so........
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:17 am

Sounds good to me, as it's a street circuit. The show should be immense...if the China round goes ahead.

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:20 pm

street circuits in china have all been disasterous. Like the track a1gp went to and the hairpin was so tight the cars coundn't get around it, or the melcho (sp?) hairpin at Macau where there's a permenant yellow flag to stop overtaking because there's no room on the exit.

stupid league formula tried to do a street race in china and it didn't happen
FIA GT1 did the same
A1GP had another go and that failed to happen as well

only dtm have really managed a china street race and they'vr done it twice on two different tracks
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:38 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:42 am

You are right, Chinese street circuits have been operational disasters. Even though there was a DTM race last year, it had many teething problems.

As for the new DW IndyCar, maybe it's trying to tell them something - get off 1.5 mile tracks and focus on road courses and short ovals... Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Wed Dec 07, 2011 10:47 pm

Confiremed Indycar races for 2012

Confirmed Races/Dates
1. March 25 - St. Petersburg, FL - street course
2. April 1 - Birmingham, AL - road course
3. April 15 - Long Beach, CA - street course
4. April 29 - Sao Paulo, Brazil - street course
5. May 27 - Indianapolis, IN - oval track
6. June 3 - Detroit, MI Ė street course
7. June 24 - Newton, IA - oval track (Saturday night race)
8. July 8 - Toronto, Canada - street course
9. July 22 - Edmonton, Canada - street course
10. August 5 - Lexington, OH - road course
11. August 19 - Qingdao, China (street course)
12. Aug. 26 - Sonoma, Calif. road course
13. September 2 - Baltimore, MD - street course
14. September 15 - Fontana, CA - oval track

They are still looking for 16 or 17

at the moment Texas and Las vegas are off the calendar
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:37 am

Did you get that from Speed TV? Iíve seen that schedule but it doesnít seem official yet. I find it peculiar that Texas and Las Vegas Motor Speedayís are presumably deemed too dangerous, yet the Auto Club Speedway is deemed safe for IndyCar.

Fontana is a much flatter track with less banking, but, the straightaways are longer and the radius of the corners arenít as tight Ė meaning the cars will still be running wide-open for the whole lap. Itís a real shame that the schedule doesnít include any short ovals, with the exception of Iowa. I donít think the solution to having shorter, flatter ovals was to stuff more road courses in the schedule.

The Milwaukee Mile and the New Hampshire Motor Speedway were perfect ovals for IndyCar; they were short, flat ovals that forced the drivers to brake and blend off the throttle. Sadly, commercial pressures probably dictated not racing at Milwaukee. Itís more lucrative to race in China than to race at a track with no sanctioning fee or race promoter.

I am looking forward to IndyCar in 2012 though, with the different engine manufacturers and much racier looking cars.

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:41 am

Quote :
The Milwaukee Mile and the New Hampshire Motor Speedway were perfect ovals for IndyCar; they were short, flat ovals that forced the drivers to brake and blend off the throttle.

now sit down this might be a shock, I agree completly they should both be on the schudule for 2012.
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Thu Dec 08, 2011 11:43 am

Josef Newgarten (sp?) to Sarah Fisher Hartmann Racing. I think... I might have got that wrong, but thats what I can fathom at least.
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Fri Dec 09, 2011 12:25 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Fri Dec 09, 2011 12:26 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:40 am

I think the decision to stay away from Las Vegas Motor Speedway is right, but that same thinking needs to be applied to Texas as well Ė with the level of banking and length of straightaways. I await the Fontana race with interest, itís a flatter oval but the turns arenít as tight. I cannot foresee the drivers lifting off the throttle or braking though, that only happens with short and/or properly flat ovals. Indianapolis is fine because it has four proper corners, whereas Fontana has two corners separated by long straights.

The circuit situation for IndyCar is sad, as the series really needs to be racing on short, flat ovals like Richmond and the Milwaukee Mile. But thatís not feasible, and more road/street courses have been added to disguise the issue. In general, racing on ovals is tough for IndyCar because many suitable ovals have become stock car central. Plus, very few people attend oval races that arenít the Indianapolis 500.

I would hate it for IndyCar to become a road course schedule with the exception of Indianapolis, I loved the balance of Road/Street and flat oval coursesÖwithout 1.5 mile high banked ovals.

Iíd happily ditch the overtaking free-fest that is Mid-Ohio and go back to Richmond with the new cars, not all IndyCar road courses are great.

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:00 am

agree, agree, agree, agree

fontana will be ok if the new car is fast in a straight line and has not much downforce

milwalkee is possible but it didn't get a crowd and the same with New Hampshire which is why there off the calendar. Both could be used by Indycar. I think Richmond is a Nascar owned track and therefore is ruled out, nascar don't like to share there toys with others.

It's a shame it's taken the death on someone like Dan Wheldon to stop indycar going to Nascar styled ovals.
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:38 am

Talking of the new IndyCar, it really seems a struggle on ovals according to what drivers testing it have said. Not so much on road courses though. Thatís good news if it forces them to blend off the throttle. I hope the drivers arenít wide open the whole way around Fontana, it depends on the BHP of the new engines. Iím not that optimistic though, as the turns arenít that tight Ė and there is still quite a lot of progressive banking to provide extra grip. Really, Fontana is like Michigan and the same flat out, pack racing used to happen there.

The Milwaukee Mile had a poor race promoter that knew little about motor racing, at least if you believe Robin Miller. They barley paid the sanction fee too, which IndyCar cannot absorb itself due to being so poor. That resulted in barley anybody turning up, but a major promoter is unlikely to come on-board as IndyCar isnít exactly lucrative. But what a perfect track it is.

The New Hampshire Motor Speedway would have been work in progress imo, IRL last raced there in 1996 prior to this year. Since then it had been NASCAR and nothing else, so it would have taken time for decent crowds to come, if that ever happened. The worrying thing about Loudon is that the track isnít owned by NASCAR, itís owned by Bruton Smith who is usually supportive of IndyCar with the Las Vegas and Infineon races. So if even he is getting cold feet about IndyCar, let alone NASCAR, then that is deeply worrying.

Richmond is owned by NASCAR, but they allowed IndyCar to race there for a surprising number of years. The crowds that turned up were not that bad, at around the 40,000 level. Thatís another short and relatively flat oval.

The thing about racing on 1.5 to 2.0 high banked ovals Ė it was never remotely exciting. If the racing was exciting, then maybe the risk would have been understandable Ė but watching a bunch of cars wide open on the throttle was ultra snoozy. IndyCar should have raced down an airfield if they wanted that.

BTW, good to read about Josef Newgarden racing for Sarah Fisher Racing. A talent from Indy Lights to IndyCar is unfortunately rare.


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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sat Dec 10, 2011 7:02 am

using an airfield as an oval would be fun, completely flat turn with long straights?
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Sun Dec 11, 2011 4:31 am

That would be my ideal oval track, for IndyCar and NASCAR. It would be like road course racing with the length of the braking zones. But, it would be frightening if someone had brake or brain fade, or both. The car would hit the barrier at a nasty velocity, with such speed carried down the straightaway and nothing to scrub off speed.

Still, thatís my fantasy oval Ė but short, flat ovals with tight turns are the best we can hope for. It's the same with NASCAR, generally the short tracks with tight turns produce the best racing.


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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:41 am

It says on the IndyCar website that it's 2012 calendar will be unveiled this week. What a dilemma they have with what ovals to include. Fontana is definitely on the schedule, as the Auto Club Speedway has been advertising a September date.

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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Tue Dec 20, 2011 2:22 pm

Louden and Milwaukee should be on the schdule but I doubt it. Tony George really killed open wheel taking the states, all the indycar tracks have been NASCAR ised making them incompatible with indycar. That's a big problem for the indycar.
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Wed Dec 21, 2011 6:27 am

Milwaukee is definitely not happening; the turnout was pathetic earlier this year even though the race was great. Without a promoter to pay the sanction fee, which nobody will after the dismal turnout, itís sadly a pipe dream.

Loudon also had a low turnout, but the track is owned by Bruton Smith who owns some of Americaís most lucrative race tracks. I hear that Loudon is not returning, but I think Bruton Smith could make it work if he wanted Ė I guess he doesnít and the patience has run out.

I was watching a CART race the other day from 1993, with Nigel Mansell and Fittipaldi duking it out at Cleveland. Those cars looked so much more racy and exiting than the appalling Dallara toilet that IndyCar has had since the 2000ís. I can only hope that the new turbo engines provide plenty of power and torque to make them traction-limited more often. Just like with CART, the boost on the turboís could be increased to have more horsepower.

When Champ Car went bust and I watched IndyCar road races afterwards, the IndyCars looked like they were stuck in third year. Tony Georgeís main failing imo, was his vision of an all oval series with only American drivers. When he saw how many drivers went to NASCAR and the gridís dwindled, he had no choice but to go to road courses. To consider how many non-Americans now race in IndyCar, that vision seems even more laughable.


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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Wed Dec 21, 2011 6:40 am

the poor turnouts at milwakee and louden are mainly due to them not being consistent. Run thm for 5 years with some good racing (hopefully the new car) the people will return.

expecting anyone in year 1, 2, 3 is insanity, as are santioning fee's in motorsport.
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PostSubject: Re: Indycar 2012 lineup & news   Wed Dec 21, 2011 7:01 am

Well put, tell that to the promoters who expect a miracle from the first year. I guess in this climate though, they cannot absorb losses for too long. And the uncertainly is what probably keeps potential promoters away.

Milwaukee was on the IndyCar schedule for numerous years, the turnout was good until the track went into financial difficulties last year. The track re-opened this year, and the promoter charged higher ticket prices and conducted very little advertising - giving a low turnout. Loudon returned after a very long time.

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